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Bird of Beauty - Stevie Wonder
- Thread starter wbgorex
- Start date
GregH3000
Well-known member
Bird of Beauty, Sher music version
Bird of Beauty - Stevie Wonder
This one has a bug in it that I couldn't find a way to fix. BIRD OF BEAUTY has an identical second and third ending, so I just did a repeat of the two bars, but it keeps going back to the segne instead of proceeding to the second ending and the second chorus.
Still, the Sher music versions are definitive, and I think you will find it closer to the original than your version if someone can fix the bug.
Bird of Beauty - Stevie Wonder
This one has a bug in it that I couldn't find a way to fix. BIRD OF BEAUTY has an identical second and third ending, so I just did a repeat of the two bars, but it keeps going back to the segne instead of proceeding to the second ending and the second chorus.
Still, the Sher music versions are definitive, and I think you will find it closer to the original than your version if someone can fix the bug.
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Is this how you intended it to play?
Bird of Beauty 1 - Stevie Wonder
I also "squared-up" the chart for neatness.
Chart Layout Conventions
https://forums.irealpro.com/threads/iReal-b-layout-conventions&p=301.194/#post-301
)BOB
Bird of Beauty 1 - Stevie Wonder
I also "squared-up" the chart for neatness.
Chart Layout Conventions
https://forums.irealpro.com/threads/iReal-b-layout-conventions&p=301.194/#post-301
)BOB
GregH3000
Well-known member
No, not quite, but amazing work in making it normal size. Very close! The only problems with your fix are:
(a) Not enough repeat bars for the G6/9 chord (you have six instead of seven), and
(b) Second chorus doesn't play, instead the "al fine" kicks too early. The vamp at the bottom should proceed from the chorus repeat.
What is the general rule when you have three endings, but two and three are identical? Do they have to be on top of each other as in your repair job?
Thank you very much for taking the time to repair my work; I appreciate your effort as I really love this song and how it sounds on iReal Pro. Any chance you could figure out how to fix this chart completely?:y:
UPDATE: I just tried fixing it myself after reading the additional info on layout conventions. I fixed the G6/9 problem, but it is still skipping the second chorus and the player skips ahead to the coda instead.
(a) Not enough repeat bars for the G6/9 chord (you have six instead of seven), and
(b) Second chorus doesn't play, instead the "al fine" kicks too early. The vamp at the bottom should proceed from the chorus repeat.
What is the general rule when you have three endings, but two and three are identical? Do they have to be on top of each other as in your repair job?
Thank you very much for taking the time to repair my work; I appreciate your effort as I really love this song and how it sounds on iReal Pro. Any chance you could figure out how to fix this chart completely?:y:
UPDATE: I just tried fixing it myself after reading the additional info on layout conventions. I fixed the G6/9 problem, but it is still skipping the second chorus and the player skips ahead to the coda instead.
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This plays AABAB Coda. Is that what you want?
Bird of Beauty 2 - Stevie Wonder
It's easier for me to understand want you mean if you describe the song's form using the rehearsal mark labels.
You could also say A1 A2 B A2 B Coda
Did I guess correctly which G6/9 you meant?
If you post your "fixed" chart, then someone edits a duplicate of that and so on, future readers will be able to follow the chart's evolution.
If there's space on the page.....
It's easier for the eye to read/play when you "stack" the endings. Sometimes there's not enough space.
More
PLAYER CHARTS vs. READER CHARTS
https://forums.irealpro.com/threads/BEGINNERS-start-here&p=25854.2157/#post-25854
)BOB
Bird of Beauty 2 - Stevie Wonder
It's easier for me to understand want you mean if you describe the song's form using the rehearsal mark labels.
You could also say A1 A2 B A2 B Coda
Did I guess correctly which G6/9 you meant?
If you post your "fixed" chart, then someone edits a duplicate of that and so on, future readers will be able to follow the chart's evolution.
If there's space on the page.....
It's easier for the eye to read/play when you "stack" the endings. Sometimes there's not enough space.
More
PLAYER CHARTS vs. READER CHARTS
https://forums.irealpro.com/threads/BEGINNERS-start-here&p=25854.2157/#post-25854
)BOB
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GregH3000
Well-known member
YOU DID IT!! Yes!! Thank you!!!! It sounds AWESOME.
I just edited the title and the tempo (used SM in title as you suggested) so I can share.
Good suggestion on the form abbreviation; I should have thought of that. I will make sure to do that if another problem comes up.
I liked the way you used the repeat bars for the G6/9 section; I'm going to remember that trick, too! Very cool.
One last question: Is there a fast and easy way to delete a chart?
I just edited the title and the tempo (used SM in title as you suggested) so I can share.
Good suggestion on the form abbreviation; I should have thought of that. I will make sure to do that if another problem comes up.
I liked the way you used the repeat bars for the G6/9 section; I'm going to remember that trick, too! Very cool.
One last question: Is there a fast and easy way to delete a chart?
Thanks, the reason to code titles with the version is to tell them apart in your library. Remembering which number is which becomes a problem.
Notice I left a couple of bars after the repeat so the DS instruction would work correctly. If the DS was under the last bar of the repeat, it would jump before the section repeats.
Delete a chart?
From your app's library? From a playlist? From The forums? Um, that song you can't seem to get out of your head?
)BOB
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Bird Of Beauty - Stevie Wonder
There's some structure error in that chart (2 bars of G69 missing at the end of the bridge) and also there are no E-7/A or Eb-7/Ab or D9sus chords. It's simply A9 (or A13) and Ab9 (or Ab13). Before going back to G, the bass may play (optional) a D which is the tritone substitute of Ab13. It's certainly not a D9sus!
Never trust fake books (even the so called "legal" ones). I've noticed many errors in many tunes!
Cheers
GregH3000
Well-known member
I respectfully disagree. The Sher Music versions, in my experience of using them for about ten years, is that they are spot on.
That being said, the reason this chart sounds screwed up is my fault. After reading your post, I found the problem behind what you were saying regarding some of the chords (as well as two other minor mistakes easily repaired); what I did was use an alternate choice chord instead of the primary choices, and tonight, having substituted the primary chords, AND getting the measures properly scored, I think you'll find they do sound better.
However, now I am back to the original problem that I had when pdxdjazz finally helped me out the first time with this chart; this tune has a second and third ending to the A section which are identical, and on the third chorus, irp keeps repeating the first ending a second time instead of proceeding to the third ending/coda.
I have tried four or five different ways of attempting to fix this problem and I am stumped again. ARGGGHHHH!!!!!!
I am going to eat some supper now, and maybe revisit this problem child of mine another day; I am BURNED OUT for today.
Thank you for taking the time to point out the problems with this chart, CyrilleB.
That being said, the reason this chart sounds screwed up is my fault. After reading your post, I found the problem behind what you were saying regarding some of the chords (as well as two other minor mistakes easily repaired); what I did was use an alternate choice chord instead of the primary choices, and tonight, having substituted the primary chords, AND getting the measures properly scored, I think you'll find they do sound better.
However, now I am back to the original problem that I had when pdxdjazz finally helped me out the first time with this chart; this tune has a second and third ending to the A section which are identical, and on the third chorus, irp keeps repeating the first ending a second time instead of proceeding to the third ending/coda.
I have tried four or five different ways of attempting to fix this problem and I am stumped again. ARGGGHHHH!!!!!!
I am going to eat some supper now, and maybe revisit this problem child of mine another day; I am BURNED OUT for today.
Thank you for taking the time to point out the problems with this chart, CyrilleB.
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Don't get me wrong, most charts in the Chuck Sher books are correct. However, I spotted chords mistakes in some of their charts. Those mistakes are generally small. They still sound fine with the melody, but they're just not the right chords.
For ex. for some tunes, instead of a C7#9#11, they would write C-7b5. The difference is small, just one note. But it just doesn't sound the same (it usually work with the melody, though).
They are also a few (not so many) big mistakes in a few tunes.
As for the structure of "Bird of Beauty", the following chart will play correctly the form of the song on iReal Pro:
Bird Of Beauty - Stevie Wonder
For ex. for some tunes, instead of a C7#9#11, they would write C-7b5. The difference is small, just one note. But it just doesn't sound the same (it usually work with the melody, though).
They are also a few (not so many) big mistakes in a few tunes.
As for the structure of "Bird of Beauty", the following chart will play correctly the form of the song on iReal Pro:
Bird Of Beauty - Stevie Wonder
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GregH3000
Well-known member
That's an interesting take on the Sher transcriptions; you sound like you have more experience with them than I do.
As for your chart, it's perfectly fine and my chords are almost exactly the same as yours now after my changes this evening (what's up with these question marks though; I have no idea what's going on there). My only remaining issue with it is your employing common time as opposed to cut time, which personally, I think is much more in line with the composer's intent judging from how it sounds on the recording.
As unsuccessful as my attempt at nailing this tune down has been over these past few weeks of my learning how to master the irp, if I can get that problem with the endings licked, I still think it will sound closer to the recording (just my opinion).
As for your chart, it's perfectly fine and my chords are almost exactly the same as yours now after my changes this evening (what's up with these question marks though; I have no idea what's going on there). My only remaining issue with it is your employing common time as opposed to cut time, which personally, I think is much more in line with the composer's intent judging from how it sounds on the recording.
As unsuccessful as my attempt at nailing this tune down has been over these past few weeks of my learning how to master the irp, if I can get that problem with the endings licked, I still think it will sound closer to the recording (just my opinion).
I used common time for 2 reasons:
1) the drums is clearly playing a back beat, which sound closer to R&B than samba style. There is some Brazilian influence in the song of course, but it's not a samba beat.
2) It would also work with a samba beat, but the samba style in IRP is just too syncopated (particularly the piano comping) and wouldn't work well with that song (especially when there are more than one chord in a bar)
1) the drums is clearly playing a back beat, which sound closer to R&B than samba style. There is some Brazilian influence in the song of course, but it's not a samba beat.
2) It would also work with a samba beat, but the samba style in IRP is just too syncopated (particularly the piano comping) and wouldn't work well with that song (especially when there are more than one chord in a bar)
GregH3000
Well-known member
OK, so here's another attempt four years on from that. The abbreviated format, as you requested, is Intro, A1, A2, B1, A3, B2, Coda.
The only problem left now is that iRP goes to the coda on the first play of the B section instead of the second. I tried to get around this by making it a first and second ending at the bottom, instead of using the coda symbol, but that didn't work either.
Any suggestions? Bird of Beauty - GH3K - Stevie Wonder
Thanks,
Greg
The only problem left now is that iRP goes to the coda on the first play of the B section instead of the second. I tried to get around this by making it a first and second ending at the bottom, instead of using the coda symbol, but that didn't work either.
Any suggestions? Bird of Beauty - GH3K - Stevie Wonder
Thanks,
Greg
This is the way iReal pro works with codas and second endings. The player cannot handle both. So you need to choose either one but not both in the same chart. A while ago, I've reported this issue, but I guess it must be too complicated to change it.
I've made a chart of that song as well (see the thread below) and the player can play the structure of the song correctly.
I've made a chart of that song as well (see the thread below) and the player can play the structure of the song correctly.
First, the reason for that early (your opinion) coda jump:
The player is doing what it is supposed to do.
The coda rules are: when you arrive at the “jump from” coda sign on the FINAL player repeat, make the jump and end.
With the player repeats set to 1x, the first play is the FINAL.
2x won’t work as too much gets repeated.
On a simpler less complex and lengthy chart, you could add another condensed B section at the end and take the coda from there.
With only 12 systems available to work with, there just aren’t enough spaces into which to enter chords for a readable chart when formatted like your chart.
(Check out CyrilleB’s nice chart here: https://forums.irealpro.com/threads/Bird-of-Beauty-Stevie-Wonder&p=56359.4852/#post-56359 )
PLAYER CHARTS vs. READER CHARTS
https://forums.irealpro.com/threads/BEGINNERS-start-here&p=25854.2157/#post-25854
That said, I wrote out a player only version of your chart’s arrangement for you.
Bird of Beauty - GH3K 1 - Stevie Wonder
)BOB
GregH3000
Well-known member
I have (and love) CyrilleB's chart (which sounds a lot cooler now that I finally have the Blues styles downloaded), but I wanted to keep the Samba style in 2/2, and he thought 4/4 was better for emphasizing the Rnb back beat and omitting the over-the-top syncopation for the keys (can see his point, but trying to stay true to the sheet music and the composer's original intent.
On the coda issue, I think I have finally come to accept that since I usually keep everything but the jazz stuff on one play, it's never going to do what it's not programmed to do.
Haven't listened to your splendid revision, but looks fantastic, if a wee bit crowded. I don't care about the readability aspect as I'm not performing anymore anyway, and I'm usually looking at the sheet music to play along with iRP track. Thank you very much for your kind assistance, sir!
happy playing,BOB
Greg
On the coda issue, I think I have finally come to accept that since I usually keep everything but the jazz stuff on one play, it's never going to do what it's not programmed to do.
Haven't listened to your splendid revision, but looks fantastic, if a wee bit crowded. I don't care about the readability aspect as I'm not performing anymore anyway, and I'm usually looking at the sheet music to play along with iRP track. Thank you very much for your kind assistance, sir!
happy playing,BOB
Greg
